Sunday, March 15, 2009

Replace Both Palestinian Leaderships With Goats

This second-generation Palestinian refugee is about to embark on yet another rant regarding his leaderships' mishandling of the refugee saga. The fact that there's little mention of Israel doesn't absolve the Zionist entity of its responsibility. However, Israel has her own internal critics, the many Gideon Levy's and Amira Hass's, while we Palestinians never seem to have enough Sari Nusseibi's and ....umm.. who else do we have?
You get my point.
Read on.

- - -

The fact that the Palestinian refugees keep wallowing in misery while George Galloway receives a Palestinian Passport from Hamas leader Ismail Haniyeh enrages me to the point of advocating the wholesale slaughter of our two Palestinian Leaderships and their replacement with goats.

As a sapling, I once raided my mother's closet, put on her silver stilettos and wiggled around the salón to the tune of the infamous "Shik Shak Shok".

My parents, both products of the rugged Palestinian refugee camps were hardly entertained by my attempt at becoming the next belly-dance sensation, so they administered a beating with the dreaded belt.

Don't cry for me, revenge was swift.

My mother, whom I specifically resented for picking the thickest belt, opened her sizeable jewellery box that night only to find a nasty surprise. Let's just say it wasn't chocolate.

But father was so scarred by the stiletto incident hat he pursued two antidotes to ensure his son would grow up to be a "zalameh" - a real man.

The first of which was military-exposure therapy. For two consecutive summers, I was dropped off at an army base where I became the ward of an uninspiring uncle who cut hair for a living. While I wasn't allowed to handle any weapons, I did roam the base, Capri-sonne juice in hand, befriending heat-stricken, listless soldiers and high-pitched one-eyed cats that hung around the base's Keralan cook like a stubborn case of genital herpes.

This was the nouveau-riche Gulf in the early years, where the indigenous population was too busy crashing their newly acquired Benzes into stray camels to inlist in the army, so most of the soldiers were imported - from Yemen.

Verily I say, had Uncle Sam not kept his aircraft carriers nearby, our Persian friends would have overrun such bases and their pathetic soldiers within minutes. Although our valiant one-eyed cats would have been fierce and steadfast enough to inflict significant casualties on the Baseej.

Little did my father know that being surrounded by moustachioed military personnel not only reinforced my love for males and their behinds, but I grew up to develop a severely debilitating uniform fetish. Many years later, when I was strip-searched by uniformed Syrian gendarmes at the Beirut Airport, I knelt down in prayer and thanked Allah for this stroke of good fortune.

To this very day I still stroke myself just thinking of that whole affair...

Back to my father's antidotes to gayness, the second of which was visits to the maslakh (slaughterhouse), where I witnessed the slitting of throats of sheep and goats. Despite the disturbing sight of cattle gasping for air as they choked on their own crimson blood, I never developed a violent side. Although I do occasionally fantasize about taking to the maslakh people who annoy me. The ever-lengthening list includes all kinds of loud, obnoxious creatures, ranging from cockatoo-coiffed queer Italians who take it upon themselves to destroy the relaxed ambiance at my favourite café, to hordes of portly Moroccan-Jewesses who run me over with their shopping carts as they advance in phalanx formation towards the freshly-discounted couscous at the nearby Wall-Mart.

However, the top spot in my maslakh list will always be reserved to our notoriously malicious and incompetent Palestinian leaderships. Not only would I like to take them to the maslakh, but I would free the goats and invite them to Gaza and Ramallah where they would replace them. Do not attempt to convince me otherwise, our ungulate friends, if given the appropriate powers will actually make better decisions.

This is fast becoming my credo, especially as I examine our leaderships' inability to build any kind of functioning pre-state, despite billions of dollars in aid money that has flowed into our coffers since Oslo. I will also add that our Palestinian voters who have elected these animals should also get an invitation to the maslakh. Then I would round up the millions of our arm-chair cheerleaders around the world who continue to encourage "resistance" instead of holding us at least partially accountable for the 60-year catastrophe that we have helped perpetuate.

So Mr. Haniyeh, explain to me why that cheeky Galloway deserves a Palestinian Passport, while my grandmother who has lived in a refugee camp since 1948, and who clings to the key to her old house can't get one?

I know the Zionist entity won't allow her into Gaza, but then what about the refugees living in the camps of Jabalyah and Al-Shati? tell me Mr. Haniyeh, why haven't you built homes for them in Gaza's vacated Jewish settlements? Instead you continue to use the "liberated" land to train the young and poison their minds.

In lieu of undulating to "Shik Shak Shok", they wrap their waists in plastic explosives and goose-step to the tunes of your fashistic songs, all while you stroke yourself in excitement thinking of all the new Qassams you'll be able to smuggle with the millions of dollars that will now flow into Gaza after the bombardment you've helped bring upon their heads.

But worry not ya Haniyeh, you and your hobbits aren't the only targets here. You were hardly imaginative with your gift to Galloway by the way:

Abu-Mazen beat you to it, by bestowing Palestinian citizenship upon Daniel Barenboim. Although I prefer the peace-loving pianist to the bombastic Galloway, someone needs to remind Abu-Batata that his own people, including my grandmother are more worthy recipients of such a citizenship.

Again, I don't expect my grandmother's resettlement just yet, give her something symbolic, a temporary passport but more importantly an apology in the name of all the leaders before you who stripped her of her humanity and used her as a pawn against other Arabs and Israel.

In the meantime, what I do demand is a reformation of the PA, the removal of all the bahayem who line their pockets with the aid money. Dollars we were very lucky to receive in the first place. Wallah, African nations with more pressing needs are starving while we sit back, multiply, beg for handouts and get angry at the world when it doesn't go that extra step and wipe our asses for us.

Speaking of asses, or goats, I will continue to advocate for the removal of both leaderships and their replacement with the latter, and while I don't expect to succeed, I could at least convince some of our sheep-like cheerleaders, that support for the Palestinians should come with a condition that we reform and start treating our own people more like people, and less like goats.

In the meantime, you can watch Haifa Wehbe shimmying her goat-like udders to Shik Shak Shok and when you're done, don't forget to read my other refugee-related posts listed below the video.



- - -

Dance of the Farting Bears
On the Palestinian Right of Return

The Palestine Refugee Saga -- Part II

The Palestine Refugee Saga -- Part I

131 comments:

G said...

Nizo;
Well, you and my family have a thing in common - both love "Shik Shak Shok"! My kids loved it so much after we heard it once on the car radio, I summoned the song home via Emule. For quite some time afterwards, I would play the song on the computer speaker to enjoy seeing my kids dance around, clapping. Well not exactly dancing. more like to drunk bears about to pass out (they are 7 and 3 years old).

And when will you finally get over that shopping cart incident? If I remember your original post correctly, it was only one Jewess and one cart, and you had your face in a pile of Lebanese Tehina at the time so it was probably your fault (its always the Palestinian’s fault when we run over and crush them). Now we hear the incident in the Plural? Walla, another example of Palestinian exaggeration....

Sorry to hear about the belt thing, sounds pretty bad. It seems to me the real revenge ist the ‘chocolate’ you left in your mother’s jewelry box – but rather the Canadian chocolate you like to visit so often…J

G

Nizo said...

"Walla, another example of Palestinian exaggeration...."
It's hyperbolic imagination put to a good cause :)

As for the Canadian chocolate, don't knock it till you try it.

Aviv said...

Nizo for Prez. Change we can believe in.

Anonymous said...

This post is

1-One-Sided as it conveniently forgets that Israel started this 60genocide against the Palestinians in 1948 when it robbed them of their land.
2-You do not mention that Hamas is primarily a welfare organization that gives to the poor and that's how it built its popularity. Hamas does have military wing but it only attacks in retaliation to the humiliation of the occupation.
3-There are not that many moderates on the Israeli side, otherwise you would see many more people voting for peace parties like Meretz.

I'm sad to say Nizo but you could be using your writing talents to expose Israel and all their crimes against your people.

Shame on you for providing Israel with this fig-leaf.

G said...

Nizo;

Oh, I wouldn’t dream of knocking it, really (my adventurousness is limited mainly to the virtual). I was just pointing out the very Freudian link apparent in your post: The Butt (belt) whipping you received is mirrored to the butt 'whipping' you now administer.

G

Str8Q8i said...

I will treat your attack on the Gulf people as a personal attack on me.

You will enjoy it when we find you and feed you your own genitals you homo collaborator.

كس امك يا شرموط يا ولد القحيه و كس اختك المحرومه من زب ابوها يا منيك يا مخنث

Anonymous said...

Nizo, there's plenty good people on the palestinian side. There's Hanan Ashrawi, Salam Fayadd, who's out now but still... there's Bassem Nasr, there's all these people in the third way party...Have you ever thought of being politically active yourself?Or are you already?
I really like Levy and Hass btw. Gideon Levy is not only a brilliant journalist, he's also got good taste: his dating a Swedish gal,Ormestadt, also a writer.
Bye now, Helen

Anonymous said...

BTW, speaking as a sheep-like cheerleaders, which undoubtebly I am, (nice expression btw :))let me say that I agree with you, palestinian leadership should take more responsibility. We who call us your friends sometimes do have a patronizing attitude, refusing to see the violation of human rights within the PA, refusing to see the corruption etc. I agree. But it's not as if Israeli goverments hasn't done their absolute best to make a palestinian state impossible....
Do you have any hope for sane solutions like the Geneva initiative?
Bye now, Helen

Nobody said...

Anonymous said...

Nizo, there's plenty good people on the palestinian side. There's Hanan Ashrawi, Salam Fayadd, who's out now but still... there's Bassem Nasr, there's all these people in the third way party..


All these people amount exactly to two seats out of 132 that were up to grabs during the last election. And may Allah irritate your face for the mere mentioning of the name of Hanan Ashrawi. Ya Allah, what an embarrassing and irritating woman she is. Oh, and Gideon Levy :D :D I am not surprised with his dating choice at all. It takes someone with a triple Stockholm Syndrome and multiple OCD obsessions for perpetual rooting for hopeless underdogs to date a person like him

:D :D

Anonymous said...

Yea, as if the moderate Israeli left is so succesful in Israel...Levy is a brilliant journalist and he's also pretty cute. And Hanan Ashrawi is also brilliant. May Oden, Thor and Loke irritate YOUR face for dissing these fine people.
:D
Helen

Nobody said...

Str8Q8i said...

I will treat your attack on the Gulf people as a personal attack on me.

You will enjoy it when we find you and feed you your own genitals you homo collaborator.


Well, I am not sure as to how soon you will find Nizo, so I would suggest you will start with that poor camel stuck in front of your house. It should be a much easier pray for sheep herders like you. If not then you can call general Schwarzkopf. I am sure he will be more than happy to help you to subdue the stubborn beast

:D :D

Nobody said...

Anonymous said...

Yea, as if the moderate Israeli left is so succesful in Israel...


In terms of practical recommendations the Israeli parallel to the Third Way is not the left but the two state center, something the style of Kadima. But the Left too is certainly more than the two seats and used to be a formidable force to reckon with...

BabaGannouj said...

i totally agree with you. the whole thing is a mockery.

not that we have a better model in lebanon. emile lahood (our previous president) used to distribute the legion d'honeur like bonbons.

Mo-ha-med said...

Shik shak shok? I'm sure you can do better.

I remember when, while Lauren Booth was stuck in Gaza, to pass the time Haniyya decided to hold a ceremony and also hand her a Palestinian passport - yalla, kollo bebalash..
At one point I believe that Abbas - or was it Arafat? - gave a random Egyptian singer honorary citizenship.

But I'm not sure what a Palestinian passport would do you - or your grandmother - any good. Especially one issued in Gaza City.

And we both know that you're not going to get one issued in Ramallah even if you lived a decade there (as is the case for an American Palestinian man I knew in Ramallah): once a refugee, always a refugee.

As for the people in the refugee camps - I'm guessing there's a problem with holding onto the UNRWA identification, with the benefits - meager as they may be - it entails while being issued national identification..

Which brings us to the everlasting issue of the symbolism, the recognition, etc. And I don't think that, if symbolic recognition there was to be, the refugees would want it to come from either Palestinian governments; I think they couldn't care less about them. Naah. The symbolic recognition ought to come from the Israelis.

As for replacing leaders with goats - eh. Why not. At least they'll probably more eloquent, and, more importantly, will not hold on to power for quite as long as our human leaders. What's the average lifespan of a goat? Anything short of 28 years, I'm voting for the goat.


Str8q8ti - as a wise man once said, go fuck a goat.


Nobody - the operative word in your last comment is 'used to be'. The Israeli left is dead. The choice in the last elections, as I had argued before, was between a right wing (Likud) and a center-right party (Kadima), itself an offshoot of the former. Israelis have long chosen to let go of the choice of peace they never really tried - barely dipped their toes and promptly hurried back to the cosy blanket of populism.

As for Hanan Ashrawi - I have met her a few times and found her quite irking - but she is a brilliant woman nevertheless.

|3run0 said...

With leaders like these and supporters like Str8Qi8, Nizo's granny is not getting a passport anytime soon.

I take as a given that most of the 'supporters' the Palestinian cause are more anti-Israeli (or anti-Semitic) than pro-Palestinian. Palestinians are merely the stick with which people who don't like the idea of a Jewish state beat Israel, literally or rhetorically.

Far more unforgiven is the fact that the Palestinian leadership seems to subscribe to the same principle.

|3run0 said...

In other news, General Norman Schwarzkopf (ret.) is reportedly very confused after a caller from Kwait asked him to beat up some dude in Canada.

Mo-ha-med said...

Bruno: "I take as a given that most of the 'supporters' the Palestinian cause are more anti-Israeli (or anti-Semitic) than pro-Palestinian."

This assumption seems both extreme and impossible to prove, don't you think?

|3run0 said...

"This assumption seems both extreme and impossible to prove, don't you think?"

True, I was being way too simplistic, especially considering that on this thread the only person who could fit my description is that deranged goat fucker. So, my apologies for that.

Yet, it is true that Palestinians are nearly universally mistreated in the Arab world, and that their suffering elicits little sympathy when not committed by Israelis. Moreover, the well-being of actual flesh-and-blood Palestinians is seen as secondary to keeping their ancestral grievances alive, and the positive steps necessary to create a successful Palestinian state are an afterthought among the endless condemnation of Israeli actions*, if mentioned at all.

So my statements seems to hold true for a significant part of the Arab public, or at the very least its leaders and opinion makers; and is certainly true for Islamists and far-leftists.

_____________
* I'm not claiming condemnation isn't well deserved.

Nobody said...

Nobody - the operative word in your last comment is 'used to be'. The Israeli left is dead. The choice in the last elections, as I had argued before, was between a right wing (Likud) and a center-right party (Kadima), itself an offshoot of the former. Israelis have long chosen to let go of the choice of peace they never really tried - barely dipped their toes and promptly hurried back to the cosy blanket of populism

Israeli left is not dead, it's simply shrank to the point of irrelevance. But my point was not if it's dead or alive but that the Third Way's equivalent in Israeli politics is not the left but the center. Also it's impossible to draw such parallels between the two societies because Israeli politics are more centrist in general. The differences are now mostly tactical. There is no party among the biggest four which rejects the two state idea in principle. Netanyahu may be talking about economic peace, Lieberman will claim he is not going to negotiate under fire and that if it's two states, then Umm al-Fahem and other Israeli Arabs areas should be on the Palestinian side. But it's mostly details.

Meanwhile the Palestinians in Gaza are ruled by a movement that in its official manifesto postulated that the day of judgment won't come until the Muslims fight the Jews, killing them one by one, with a little bit of help from trees and stones. Only the Gharkad tree is reported to be uncooperative, because it's claimed to be one of the trees of Jews.

And if I believe Nizo, the very moment Israel removes its checkpoints, Hamas takes over the West Bank too. But otherwise I tend to agree with you - no one can beat Arabs when it comes to peace making

:D :D

nominally challenged said...

I have no idea what a gharkad tree actually is, but every time I read (or read about) that particular hadith, I have a little chuckle to myself at the thought of being protected by a tree covered in small green, sweet-pickled cucumbers ...

Anonymous said...

Bruno,it's generally a bad idea to assume too many things about one's political opponents. Many supporters of the palestinians do not hate Israel or the idea of a jewish state, we simply think the palestinian should have one as well. And no, many of us do realise that itIsrael's not the only culprit, we have Lebanon, Egypt and the arab leauge who refused the refugees citizenship in their own countries.

Nobody, Israeli goverments talk about a two state solution, but keeps building out settlements, aka facts on the ground.According to Peace now, settlements has increased. And then there's the natural growth. Indeed, if the US can't force Israel to behave, soon the whole idea of a two state solution will be over.

Mohamed, you've met her? Nice. You didn't like her? I've heard she's stepping out, any idea who'll replace her? what's your opinon about Fayyadd's resignation?

Helen

Anonymous said...

it's not about politics, it's about the islamic ideology those leaders follow.

Nobody said...

nominally challenged said...

I have no idea what a gharkad tree actually is, but every time I read (or read about) that particular hadith, I have a little chuckle to myself at the thought of being protected by a tree covered in small green, sweet-pickled cucumbers ...


Good point. What actually is this tree? I read occasionally Muslims saying that if Jews don't believe in the Hadith of the Gharkad tree, then why they keep planting it all around.

Nobody said...

Anonymous said...

Bruno,it's generally a bad idea to assume too many things about one's political opponents. Many supporters of the palestinians do not hate Israel or the idea of a jewish state, we simply think the palestinian should have one as well. And no, many of us do realise that itIsrael's not the only culprit, we have Lebanon, Egypt and the arab leauge who refused the refugees citizenship in their own countries.


Sure Helen. We also noticed how many of you do not reject the idea of a Jewish state or hold the Arab league responsible for anything. Who are you are feeding your fairy tales, you think?

Nobody said...

And no, many of us do realise that itIsrael's not the only culprit, we have Lebanon, Egypt and the arab leauge who refused the refugees citizenship in their own countries.

Who is talking about the citizenship? They killed Palestinians by dozens of thousands. Not that I care so much, but if you are talking about this, then this is what you should have on your mind. And what's about Arab rejection of the two state solution in 1948? What's about the wars they started? The terror?

"we have Lebanon, Egypt and the arab leauge who refused the refugees citizenship in their own countries" .. Don't make people laugh with these clumsy attempts to prove your objectivity

nominally challenged said...

I read occasionally Muslims saying that if Jews don't believe in the Hadith of the Gharkad tree, then why they keep planting it all around.

My own garden's full of them. Isn't yours?

I grow the Tel El Rabi native variety - known in Arabic as the gharkhad f'il teez.

nominally challenged said...

On a botanical note - the gharkad is apparently the Arabic for boxthorn - known in Hebrew as אטד - which you can read about here:

http://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/אטד

Nobody said...

Mine? I don't know. I am trying to grow this shit you once recommended for boosting my emotional intelligence. This one. But it never produces any flowers and keeps dying after a few days. Is this that god damn tree? By the way, my emotional intelligence is nevertheless way up, many people congratulate me with the change. It is years since the last time I called the Arabs monkeys or warned them to start watching their tales.

Nobody said...

tales=tails

nominally challenged said...

Hahaha, that one, you'll be pleased to know, is actually the fitna - a very apt tree for you to try growing. If you can't get it to grow here, try doing it in Holland. They have experience with these things over there.

Seriously though - the fitna or frangipani, is an extremely easy tree to grow. So if it's not working for you, maybe you should give up on your attempts at botany and go back to poetry - you were always so good at that :)

Nobody said...

NC

Ever since I managed to rid my vocabulary of the monkeys word I am on a charming offensive against the Arab side. So I don't really have much time for poetry. However, if the other side continues to prove resilient to my charms and keep locking me out of their blogs, I may consider in serious giving up on this and going back to try my hand again at growing Gharkad trees.

Mo-ha-med said...

Nobody,
why would we lock you out of our blogs? your ill-behaved honesty makes you a very welcome commentator. Plus you give us the chance to say 'this guy represents the israelis, see how hateful he is'. So by all means, comment away :)

I actually had no idea what gharkad was. cute tree though.

However, I think everyone should plant marijuana in their gardens. And vote for the Green Leaf party. Because as everyone knows, a good (Jew/Arab) is a happy (Jew/Arab).

Helen - yes, I have met her. A friend of mine worked in her organisation (Miftah), and I went there several times. She's incredibly pretentious and bossy - and acts like an adorable person in formal occasions, carries a very interesting conversation, etc.. a perfect polititian. Personally, I'd vote for her as president...
Stepping down, you say? From what, her NGO? I had no idea..

Nobody said...

Mo-ha-med

Don't bullshit me with your vegetarian stuff. I have nothing to do with this. If we keep planting Gharkad trees everywhere like mad, it's for security reasons. In terms of happiness I stick to my e pills.

Nobody said...

Never mind that as they say: Two Jews -three opinions. A Jew cannot represent even himself, how can he represent another Jew?

dveej said...

Nizo, does the shiksa in Shik Shak Shok have a brother? and maybe he has a video, Shey Getz Shok oder so was...? Inquiring minds want to know...

t

|3run0 said...

Helen, you are right about me overgeneralizing; see my reply to Mo-ha-med.

Salam Fayyad is a pragmatic, competent and honest guy. Which is why, I guess, neither Hamas nor Fatah like him very much

Nobody said...

|3run0 said...

Helen, you are right about me overgeneralizing; see my reply to Mo-ha-med.


Bruno

Why are you apologizing all the time? What are you afraid of? One may think that Rio is a kind of Malmo where locals are under siege by hordes of immigrants from the Middle East. And even if it gets dangerous, ask NC to send you seeds of Gharkad trees and the day of judgment will never come

karen said...

*Yawn* there goes 2 minutes and 51 seconds of my life that I will never get back ...

Anonymous said...

It's ok, Bruno, I'm a overgeneralizer myself. :)

Nobody, I've never said I was objective, I'm propalestinian. What I said was that I've got nothing against a jewish state nor do I blame Israel for everything. (a lot, but not everything)'tis strange you should think I'm trying to be miss balanced.

Mohamed,
You like the green leaf? What's wrong with Meretz? I never figure you for a green guy, but I'll guess I 'll just have to read your blog more...Or were you just kidding? BTW your hasbara post was hilarious :) You probably know more than I do, but I read Ashwravi saying that she was going to retire from politics and give support for a young, female candidate. Don't know if she meant it. Shame, though. Had I've been a palestinian, I'd voted for her or Fayyad...As for her being bossy and pretentious, I can believe that. I think it comes with the territory if you're a politician, at least if you're high up. My uncle is a member of the EU parlament...pretty bossy and pretentious, (though pretty charming) but a real real nice guy in public :D
Who do you think will replace Fayyadd?
Helen

Nobody said...

I see, Helen. But even for a person who claims to be pro Palestinian, to say such a thing "And no, many of us do realise that Israel's not the only culprit, we have Lebanon, Egypt and the arab leauge who refused the refugees citizenship in their own countries." is a kinda... But then it does not look like you are on good terms with the history of this region

Gila said...

Great post. I realize that I am part of the evil Zionist Entitiy, but still...when you drop off your guys, could you take some of ours? I can think of several politicians and political parties who would be improved if replaced with goats.

Aviv said...

I'm with Gila. Off the top of my head: Lieberman, Shas, Agudat Yisrael and nincompoops of the big parties like Ben-Eliezer.

Nizo said...

G,
Thanks for the free psychiatry session. I used to go to psychiatric counselling when I was younger and I once made a counsellor cry in frustration, you obviously have more solid.

Aviv,
Mwah, I still lament your non-visit to Montréal.


Anonymous accusing me of being one-sided,
1-The Arabs had their fair share oregarding the 1948 Nakba.
2-Charity or not, Hamas is an ideologically regressive and bloodthirsty organization.
3-Hamas helped destroy the Israeli left after continuously bombing Israeli buses, and this at the height of the Oslo years.

Str8Q8i,
Thank you for offering to feed me my own genitals, I have always envied dogs and contortionists. As for calling my mother a whore, you could at least spell whore properly.

Helen,
We never have enough moderates to counter the Hamas baboons and the Fatah thugs..

Beitenjan-mtabbal,
Bonbons or not, I would still prefer Lebanon over Gaza, at least with your fantastic nigh life.

NB,
Ashrawi is the ultimate in arrogance - and eloquence.

M7amamd,
"once a refugee, always a refugee." True, I would bet my left testicle that the West Bankers would be just as welcoming of us as the Israelis. Effectivement, no one wants the 48 refugees...

NC,
"gharkhad f'il teez."
Don't get me all excited please..

Bruno,
Welcome back!

Dveej and Karen,
Haifa is our Pamela Anderson... talentless but big-titted

Gila,
I'm preparing a post in Hebrew that takes care of your goats as well.

Nizo said...

*you obviously *are* more solid.

Nobody said...

Dveej and Karen,
Haifa is our Pamela Anderson... talentless but big-titted


Go easy with Haifa. I worship this woman. In particular after that accident when she crushed with her head a wing of an airplane.

Nizo said...

Nobody
"Go easy with Haifa. I worship this woman."

I find the way you objectify women to be revolting and utterly unacceptable. This is a family-friendly blog that doesn't tolerate such behaviour.

You're deepening your Karmic imbalance by the day. I suggest you go up a couple of Karmic points by saying something nice to Helen.

Nobody said...

You're deepening your Karmic imbalance by the day. I suggest you go up a couple of Karmic points by saying something nice to Helen.

May Allah irritate your face and erase your Karma for just suggesting such an obscenity. I am now joining Str8Q8i and calling on wild dogs to come and rip your genitalia to pieces

Anonymous said...

You never pay attention, Nizo. Nobody's been sweettalking me non stop. :D
Does it have to be in Hebrew, Nizo? Your post on Israeli politicians, I mean.
Helen

Anonymous said...

You better be making a pretty large cut from the Israelis to write this evil perverted stuff. I wouldn't be surprised if you're an Israeli agent with an agenda to ruin the image of Arabs.

And by the way you're wrong, Hamas IS a charitable organization. As for the bus bombings you refer to there are reports that the Mossad is responsible to get world sympathy for Israel.

I suggest you read up on the Lavon affair.

karen said...

Yeah Nizo, the image that the world has of Arabs is all your fault, you, you, you Jew!!! Yeah, you're probably not a brainy, witty Palestinian at all. No such thing! You are probably a Jew!! Now everything makes sense. You speak Hebrew, tried to learn Yiddish and loved those ashkeNazi old Jews, dis the Palestinian leadership and you're queer. Everyone who is anyone knows that there is no such thing as a queer Arab. Thank Allah for your manly man true Arab commentators who have made us all see the light, you Palestinian poser you! ;-)

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Nizo said...

Anonymous, don't flood my blog with wikipedia articles. There's such a think as a "link"..(and you can disagree with Karen, but calling her a cow is uncalled for)

Also, the Lavon affair is one thing, but to extrapolate and claim that the Mossad is responsible for the Tel Aviv bus bombings is a sign of pure genius.

You can't imagine how much I agree with you.

In fact, I've had an annoying callous on my right foot for a month but after this exchange I've concluded that it's no callous at all, surely it's a tracking device that the Mossad implanted in my foot in order to track the movements of their favourite agent. You've outed me anonymous, what can I say.

karen said...

Now that the Sandmonkey has linked to you again you're going to probably have a couple of nasty genocidal maniacs popping by for a visit. Conversely, he has some funny and intelligent followers too.

Meooooooow (I don't do mooo).

|3run0 said...

Helen: "You never pay attention, Nizo. Nobody's been sweettalking me non stop"

The man is in love Helen. He can't help it. ;^D

|3run0 said...

Anon, so Israel recruited Palestinian suicide bombers, had them blow up buses and pizzerias, and then somehow convinced Hamas et al. to praise and take responsibility for these actions. Is Hamas part of this conspiracy or were they under control of the Zionist mind rays?

In fact, if Mossad wanted to do false-flag blog posting to discredit the Palestinian cause, your comments would be a far more effective tool than Nizo's post.

Helen, tin foil is what hats used by the likes of Anon are made of. To protect against Zionist mind rays and Venusian ear beetles.

|3run0 said...

NB, I'm terribly sorry! I'll stop apologizing at once, I promise. I can only ask for your forgiveness. ;^D

BTW, I wonder what kind of plant Pavlic Morosov had in his garden ;). We should try planting this Garkhad thing on the favelas.

Anonymous said...

Didn't this big titted Haifa do a music video where she walks through a Palestinian refugee camp in Lebanon or something and it really pissed off the Leb. Christians?

-Ellie

Nobody said...

Anonymous said...

Didn't this big titted Haifa do a music video where she walks through a Palestinian refugee camp in Lebanon or something and it really pissed off the Leb. Christians?


You mean a clip with children being transformed into masked militants? As far as I know that was called Julia. AChristian by the way. Haifa is above this shit. She does not mess with anything smaller than airplanes

Nobody said...

|3run0 said...

NB, I'm terribly sorry! I'll stop apologizing at once, I promise. I can only ask for your forgiveness. ;^D

BTW, I wonder what kind of plant Pavlic Morosov had in his garden ;). We should try planting this Garkhad thing on the favelas.


Bruzo

Gharkad tree is our sacred tree, the ultimate judgment day stopper. You don't plant it in your lousy favelas and neither this moronic Pavlic Morozov should be in any way traced to our sacred tree. Those seeds from NC were a one time gift presented to you from the Israeli people for your outstanding contribution to the Zionist cause.

Nobody said...

And by the way you're wrong, Hamas IS a charitable organization. As for the bus bombings you refer to there are reports that the Mossad is responsible to get world sympathy for Israel.


Helen

I will get ahead of Aviv and inform you that here the anon has demonstrated another prominent feature of the Arab mentality - conspiratorial paranoia.I am absolutely serious by the way.

Aviv said...

Nizo, moi aussi. Some other time.

Re: Israeli gov't-authored blogs, I can only wish the people in charge of PR were so witty, daring and imaginative. Heck, I'd start with competent. They can't even get the IDF website RSS feed to work.

Nobody - This is really just a variation on the same theme. Conspiracy here is employed as a way of denying reality and preserving honor. (BTW, notice Hamas kills "in retaliation to humiliation" - If you make me lose face, you die so I can restore honor).

Anonymous said...

Nobody, perhaps you can guess that I wholeheartedly disagree with you...
Helen

Nobody said...

Helen

It's pretty much irrelevant if you agree with me or nor as you cannot have an informed opinion on these matters. I am simply telling you how it is.

Anonymous said...

"Helen, tin foil is what hats used by the likes of Anon are made of. To protect against Zionist mind rays and Venusian ear beetles."

Bruno, I wouldn't be suprised if anon is one of these people who call in to radio shows, claiming that he's seen aliens in his backyard.:D

Nobody, I like your attitude....Irrelevant if I agree or not since you know you're right, right? :D
Helen

Nobody said...

No. It's not. But I don't have patience right now to start with this one. Go to Nizo, ask him

Nobody said...

I will take it on myself to explain this to you, so you won't say that I am rude or dismissive or anything.

So here we go. People who get exposed to the Middle East, even through blogs, usually very quickly notice this conspiracy mindset. It's simply very difficult to miss. And it's a fundamental thing, it's an integral part of the culture and mentality.

If you don't get it then you can't understand even 10% of what's going on here. The Middle East is only half as extreme as it appears to outsiders. In fact, it's not the reactions of people here that are so extreme but their perception. The perception simply conditions people's reactions. If you don't get it then you can't understand the anti Western sentiment, the Arabs vs Persians thing, or Sunnis vs Shias. In fact, even clan wars here are heavily influenced by it. The tribal thing may have only half as much to do with the inter clan stuff as this paranoia. This thing is so fundamental, that if after so many time spent on these blogs it's still not obvious to you, then you have learned nothing.

Anonymous said...

Thank you for this analysis. Nobody, the only ME blogs I follow regulary are The traveller within plus this blog, written by two clever, witty guys, none of whom very paranoid. I believe arab minds differ as much as Swedes, everyone's an individual.
However, I suspect the best way for me to understand the ME better is to travel to Jordan, the West Bank, Egypt etc. Which I will do in good time. I can't wait to see the Pyramids, and Ramallah would be interesting too... I guess you've seen the pyramids...
Good Night (it is here anyway)
Helen

Noa said...

"Good point. What actually is this tree? I read occasionally Muslims saying that if Jews don't believe in the Hadith of the Gharkad tree, then why they keep planting it all around".

searching google, showed that the boxthorn is the Gharkad tree, which is called Atad in Hebrew.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxthorn

I've no idea why your Hadith decided that this is "a Jewish tree". Maybe since it doesn't have any edible fruits, nor proper shade?
Anyway, sorry. No one plants it in Israel.

somebody said...

Nobody, excellent analysis in the last comment.

G said...

My experience with Arab conspiracy theories is that not only are they widely believed, well educated and informed Arabs/Palestinians believe in them too, they are just ashamed of it. Scratch the surface a bit and the conspiracy believing core pops right out, though they will reject the more obviously ridiculous ones. Nizo is one of the only Bloggers I have read which are really honest about it.

The closest analogy I can find in Jewish people is the widely believed superstitions: (Ein-Hara). Many well educated people are ashamed of them, and deny believing them, but deep down they believe and act on this belief.
Identifying a self-proclaimed “man/woman” of the world as a superstitious fool is a hobby of mine, when you do catch one and know how to (ab)use this knowledge it can be loads of fun!

G

Nobody said...

Anonymous said...

Thank you for this analysis. Nobody, the only ME blogs I follow regulary are The traveller within plus this blog, written by two clever, witty guys, none of whom very paranoid.


The traveller is not very representative. Mo, even though he is running an anti Zionist blog, seems to be absolutely immune to this shit. He is not typical, I would say he is a kinda mysterious personality.

As to this paranoia thing, you don't connect between things. It's the same stuff Aviv and Nizo were talking about on the previous thread, about tribal and clan culture. The shame thing and historical backgrounds are more like theories. But in practical terms it all comes down to this: Arab societies are severely deficient on mutual trust. Of course I don't know what they are doing in places like Cairo, I doubt they live in tribes there, but in countries such as Yemen this thing runs from top to bottom, from the dictator at the top to the last shepherd in the mountains. Arabs simply use their tribal structures to compensate for this deficit of trust. That's why you have all these dictators and kings surrounding themselves by their clansmen. It's the only way you can create reliable structures in these societies. Or Islam. It's this or Islam. And conspiracy mindset is simply another manifestation of the culture of mistrust the Arabs are practicing over there

Nobody said...

Helen

I don't know if followed links on my post, but you should really read IraqPundit. This man is a genius and he is originally a Shia from Southern Iraq, he knows his people all too well. He just nails them down with his post. The Sworn Conspiracy

Nizo said...

I have to run to work so I can't elaborate much, but I would add to the conspiracy theory debate, that the lack of agency or control your typical Arab has over his own political destiny breeds all kinds of paranoia.

The fact that the culture is fatalistic to begin with, only further emphasises the lack of control that Arab has over his own destiny.

Furthermore, power is concentrated so absolutely in the hands of the few and that there's little transparency in the practice of power, will lead your average citizen to have an active imagination to fill the gap between perception and reality.

I would go further and say that not only does the conspiracy theory fill the gaps of the unknown but it has the palliative effect of reassuring us that our failures aren't of out own making, that forces stronger and more sinister are at work.
This I have heard on an Al-Jazeera debate last week:

"Where are the Arab scientists?"

"The West denies them access to scientific journals. And so they don't have the opportunity to advance"

- - - - - - - - - -

It's not our fault.. and so pride/honour is intact for yet another day.

somebody said...

nobody, umm...every culture has had tribes and clans and also every country has had its fair share of dictator-henchmen combo- not unique to the Middle East. Also you can't classify the entire middle east as being of arab ethnicity since it's a whole hotch potch of ethnicities, so the theory that paranoia in the middle east is an arab thing just doesn't make sense. The only umbrella under which all middle eastern countries fall under is not arab ethnicity but rather the predominant religion: aka islam which has had a profound effect on the thinking and mentality of the people of that region.

It might interest you to know that one of the 99 names for God in Islam is maqar: cunning.

Nobody said...

somebody said...

nobody, umm...every culture has had tribes and clans and also every country has had its fair share of dictator-henchmen combo- not unique to the Middle East.


No. Not every culture has tribes and clans and no other region in the world has this share of dictators. It's not that this region has more than its share, there is simply nothing else here unless you take sheikhs and kings out of the equation. And Arab dictatorships are a very different business, than say Russian Communists, Pinochet or whoever. It's mostly a clan business. You can say that in Syria it's not a family business, it's more like a sect business. But it does not change the fundamental fact, let alone that Alawis are also a kind of family, since it's a religion and a clan fused into one.

somebody said...

every culture *has had* tribes and clans and also every country *has had* its fair share of dictator-henchmen combo- not unique to the Middle East.

Nobody said...

Somebody

I prefer to leave "has had" to historians to debate between themselves. For me the past is pretty much irrelevant. I know many people who study history trying to fish out some lessons out of it. For me there are very few, and even these can be deduced from the actuality, you don't have to study ancient history to figure them out.

Nobody said...

But in my view your basic assumption is wrong. The Middle East in its present form was created by a failure of a certain non Western culture to manage the process of modernization. It's more about how a society mismanaged the adoption of some aspects of Western culture and technology and wrecked itself in the process. It's a modern creation. Ancient history has very little to do with this.

somebody said...

the point was that the reasoning re: clan/tribe culture is not unique to the middle east (past or present) nor is it representative of every middle eastern country.

Nobody said...

the point was that the reasoning re: clan/tribe culture is not unique to the middle east (past or present) nor is it representative of every middle eastern country.

About past I don't know, but in the present I can simply tell you in what countries around I see it expressed most and how. Say Saddam't Tikrit clan, Alawis in Syria, Fatah/Hamas affiliated clans in Gaza.

Regarding your point about Islam, Nizo can resolve it in no time. He is Christian Arab and he has a family scattered all over the Middle East from Dubai to Lebanon to Israel. My impression was that it's not that different.

somebody said...

resolve? looks like 'arabs'm aren't the only ones with trust issues. A quick look on his blog shows his beliefs are secular and he's most probably a semite not arab, if he's 'christian'...resolves the matter that not all middle easterners are arabs ;)

Nobody said...

By the way. I won't insist that this stuff is unique to the Middle East, but in those areas of the world I have any idea of I don't see anything similar in scope and intensity, this means Europe, Americas. Maybe in some parts of Asia. But I have little idea about what they have there.

Nobody said...

somebody said...

resolve? looks like 'arabs'm aren't the only ones with trust issues. A quick look on his blog shows his beliefs are secular and he's most probably a semite not arab,


I read that DNA studies on Berber and Arab populations in Morocco or Algeria found no difference between the two groups. Arabism is a matter of language.

somebody said...

"I don't see anything similar in scope and intensity, this means Europe, Americas. Maybe in some parts of Asia."

India and the caste system? yet they are not as conspiracy theory oriented as ME, in my view. maybe they are. It's hard to know how to measure these things.

"I read that DNA studies on Berber and Arab populations in Morocco or Algeria found no difference between the two groups."

Such a study doesn't mean a lot since Arab populations in Morocco are probably Berber-Arab mixes. The study would be more meaningful if it had compared the DNA of Berber people with Arabs from the Arabian gulf.

Anonymous said...

Thanks for the link. We're fundamentally different, Nobody. You have a collective pov, while I've always looked at things from an individual level. However, I guess people that live without democracy, without individual rights tend to stick to their Hamoula since they can't trust their society. Which perhaps makes it more difficult to create democracy: it becomes a vicious circle. However, unlike you I'm an optimist. I do believe that arab countries can become stable, peaceful democracies. Especially the palestinians, since they tend to have a better education.
Nizo, you probably have a point. Arabs have no reason to trust nor their leaders or their neigbhour's to begin with, and dictators have no interest in making people more enlighted, far from it. So a healthy suspicion might well turn over to paranoia, but I guess it's not common among educated people. Well, when I'll travel to the ME I 'll see for myself.:)
Helen

Nobody said...


Such a study doesn't mean a lot since Arab populations in Morocco are probably Berber-Arab mixes. The study would be more meaningful if it had compared the DNA of Berber people with Arabs from the Arabian gulf.


Frankly history is not my specialty. Though if we are talking about our region, then I remember reading on one Lebanese Christian blog that as late as 15th or something century Syriac was still widely spoken in Lebanon and Syria. Though I admit the Lebanese are inventing a lot of stuff, but you can sure check it in Wikipedia or something.

Basically I guess that for anybody even minimally aware of the great linguistic and cultural diversity of this region in pre-Islamic era, this region now looks as if everything around was wiped out by some cultural nuclear mega bomb. However, the only book I have ever read about history of the Middle East (Lewis) claimed that most of it was achieved through acculturation.

Nobody said...

India and the caste system? yet they are not as conspiracy theory oriented as ME, in my view. maybe they are. It's hard to know how to measure these things.

The closest thing to what Arabs have I know are the Jews themselves. This is despite the fact that Israelis and Arabs are like cats and dogs, they just share nothing in common. For example, I know no other nation in the world least preoccupied with the issues of shame and dignity than the nose picking and their behinds rubbing Israelis.

However strictly speaking the Jews are also a kind of a clan. It's not exactly a nation, it's more like an extended family. Jewish religion also views Jews as a sort of family, it does not define their Jewishness by religion. So basically here you have the same idea, that originated in the Middle East and was also taken to extreme. It was taken to another extreme, less bloody and more functional one, but the original idea looks to me the same one. So I would still bet on the region.

Nobody said...

However, I guess people that live without democracy, without individual rights tend to stick to their Hamoula since they can't trust their society.

Maybe. But the worst thing I can imagine happening to the Middle East is the Arabs getting democracy and individual rights. The mere thought of it sends shivers down my spine and probably the spine of many Arabs themselves. I remember reading one Syrian Christian a couple of years into Iraq's experiment who was writing: For God's sake, please everything only not democracy

:D :D

Nobody said...

Helen

If you are interested in this, you may want to read this one: When Minorities Rule

Anonymous said...

Yes, I know you don't like the idea, you wrote that before, remember :)? However I do. Churchill said something in the lines of that democracy, however bad, is better than any other system. Interesting article, but annoying. I bet this Kramer would mind very much if he himself lived under minority rule, I don't think he longs for the dhimmi status. It's strange that an american Israeli, born and raised in a great, liberal democracy, should have such a lukewarm view of democracy...This shows the enormous gap between the ME and the western world..If you really want to make me annoyed, please show me more links of that sort.. :D
Helen

Aviv said...

For example, I know no other nation in the world least preoccupied with the issues of shame and dignity than the nose picking and their behinds rubbing Israelis.

This oversimplifies matters. It's not that Israeli culture has no sense of shame; Israelis who lose their jobs certainly experience shame. Those folks whose 14-year-old kid was used as a toy to internet sex fiends certainly felt shame.

It's just a very different experience than in Arab culture. Here in the "West" these things are interpreted and treated as an individual affair, as Helen put it so eloquently, and the kid gets a shrink to help sort out his issues. By contrast, in Ba'albek he would have brought shame on an entire group and his family would have to murder him.

somebody said...

Nobody,

I think mistrust issues for the jews could be because of their history.

Aviv said...

Gharkad/boxthorn/Atad is usually mentioned in the Hebrew Bible as a lowly, useless plant, often by contrast to the Cedar. See Jotham's fable in Judges 9:14-15.

Apparently they're still trying to figure out what plant the Atad is.

Nobody said...

Aviv

I did not say that Israelis don't have this stuff at all. Everybody has its threshold. But they don't care so much. Anyway, it's a kind of off point. It does not strictly matter for the point I was making

Somebody

I did not mean to say that Jews are mistrustful, even though they may be. And I used to think that Jews are quite paranoiac because of their history. However, after I saw what the Arabs have, I came to think that we are doing not bad at all.

Helen

You remind me of these Western Leftists who used to travel to the Soviet Union to explain to locals why communism is great. Now their descendants seem to have switched ideology but they have lost nothing of their fathers persistence. You see, the only outcome of having free elections right now in, say, Egypt I can see will be with Hamas in power and Mo-ha-med in Montreal. I just can't say any better.

Anonymous said...

Well thank you.:D I'm sure I'm very similar to those people, except that communism is a terrible, repressive ideology that's responsible for the deaths of millions of people. To compare my admittedly stubborn defence of democracy to an equally stubborn defender of communism sounds like moral relativism.
I'm sure you would love to live in a minority rule. :D
Good night now. I'll have to go to sleep, so I can perserve my persistance.
PS. The greeks suffered dictatorships in the 70s, as did the spaniards. Both countries did develop into democracies, without a catastrophe for Europe.
Helen

Nobody said...

Well thank you.:D I'm sure I'm very similar to those people, except that communism is a terrible, repressive ideology that's responsible for the deaths of millions of people.

This is correct. There is no difference between the Communism which the previous generations of leftists entertained themselves with and their current fascination with democracy and human rights. These are only tools to manufacture moral clarities and other stuff with which these people fool themselves in believing that their lives have meaning, or better, are not meaningless. It's just about making one feel good about himself. No practical considerations, or real people, matter for these people. And I am speaking as one who was on the receiving end of this Western pseudo humanism

somebody said...

straying off the point somewhat but what the heck...if it's not mistrust, then why do secular ashkenaz who have been away from homeland for millenia still make a point of marrying jewish. any explanation?

Nobody said...

somebody said...

straying off the point somewhat but what the heck...if it's not mistrust, then why do secular ashkenaz who have been away from homeland for millenia still make a point of marrying jewish. any explanation?


My explanation will be along the lines of my previous comment. Because Jews also practice some sort of a Middle Eastern extended family or clan concept. Alawis marry any differently? Or Druze? It's not necessarily about mistrust. This is about identity.

somebody said...

yes, but why feel the need to practice this extended family concept?

Nobody said...

I think it's probably because this is what these types of identity are about. If you don't do it you stop being one and assimilate. The reasons may be various.. My point was more that the Jewish national identity is also a kind of a family business. It's less nationality in the normal sense of the word.

Nobody said...

My point was more like if the Jews are still preserving this idea after being "away from homeland for millenia" (your words) then you should not be surprised that it's so intense in Arab and other societies here. This is the Middle East. This is what goes there. So it may be unique to this region. Or at least not very common in other parts of the world.

Nobody said...

You see. Basically the Arabs apparently had a very similar concept and Islam was a kinda national religion of Arabs and at the beginning people who wanted to convert had to be first adopted as a member by one of the Arab clans. However Islam went on to become a universal religion and Umma is certainly too big an entity to allow people to develop a single collective identity. However, I do think and I mentioned this that Arabs do seem to be able to transcend their tribal and other stuff when they turn to Islam. At least to a certain degree.

Now Jews stayed with this idea of a nation religion, or better family religion, so in them it's a kinda fused into one. So the Jewish national identity is stronger than in many other nations, because in a way Jews are a sort of a mega family, a super clan. Call it a very extended family. The Jews are related to each other, at least theoretically. They are relatives. The Jewish sense of solidarity with each other has a certain family undertone in it.

The Arabs were apparently on a way to something similar but they did not go with this to the end. So they got stuck in between while the Jews solved the problem.
So there is a difference, but it all comes from what looks like a very similar concept. And it's a very sticky concept. At least in this part of the world. It refuses to go away.

somebody said...

Interesting analysis. But to say it's just the identity of the people of that region does not explain why they behave so. I think your explanation would go some way in explaining identity issues and the whole tribal mentality generally. But Personally, I see religion as being the key factor in this kind of behaviour, for both people groups. Eg For jews, the tribal mentality is already set in that they were not allowed to marry or be in close relation with those outside their people group, also the covenants made to the jews as a people group that they will have this or that- makes sense to stay in the fold.

Nobody said...

Well. This topic can be stretched to infinity. But I would say that when Nizo says...

Now is that feature immutable?

. . .

My brain wants to say no, but my gut insists that it is. So you can accuse my gut :)

... the gut may be not that dumb at all. Or that there may be more to this than a gut.

Anonymous said...

Nobody, you've no proof what so ever that left winger are less callous and impractical than right winger. But of course, I heard this sort of talk before. You forgot, however, to mention that you right wingers live in the real world, you represent common sense, incontrast to us. :D
Somebody, Israeli jews marries other jews because there are mosty jews in Israel, and there's a lot of mistrust and hate between Israeli arabs and Jews.
But in Europe and in the US, many jews have no problem intermarrying, there's a lot of mixed families. So it's not so simple as to say that jews stay within their own, that they have a "tribal mindset"
Helen in London

Nobody said...

Anonymous said...

Nobody, you've no proof what so ever that left winger are less callous and impractical than right winger. But of course, I heard this sort of talk before. You forgot, however, to mention that you right wingers live in the real world, you represent common sense, incontrast to us. :D


Helen

The difference between us is not a difference between a lefyist and a rightist. It's a difference between people who have to live in the real world and people who have nothing better to do in their lives than playing into Mahatma-Gandhis. You are simply bored. You have simply lost your mind out of boredom. I can easily imagine people like you traveling thousands of miles over sea and land to the faraway Papua New Guinea to express their deep admiration and respect to local cannibals. And there, when you finally find yourself on a pole being slowly rotated over a tribal fire, your fascination with the local population and its ancient culture will be so intense that you will be inquiring of the people around if they are enjoying their steak. It's absolutely not for nothing, that this shit is not called Tel Aviv syndrome, or Cairo syndrome, or Beijing syndrome, but it's called squarely Stockholm syndrome.

Our situations are very different. We, Israelis, have always been, are and will be in years to come in a very precarious situation. And probably the only thing that we can do in our situation is to unearth the remains of Theodor Herzel from his grave and feed them to dogs for getting us stuck as a tiny island planted in the middle of this see of barbarians. But you and your people are calling for tremendous troubles to come on your heads and for no other reason than having got bored by your extensive welfare system. And I swear by the name of the Almighty Allah to you, ya Helen, that you, silly Europeans, will get them !!!

Mo-ha-med said...

I understand that some simplification and generalisation is necessary for a discussion but you guys are going overboard. "Tribalism" and all that - a couple of centuries back, yeah, but most of us don't determine ties with others based on the 'tribe'.

As for democracy in the Middle East - well, it's not that bad an idea.

In a nutshell, what needs to be ensured if that the rules of the elections are not negotiable. Essentially that whomever wins the elections:
- does not put in jeopardy the basic rights;
- and does not put in jeopardy any future electoral processes
(otherwise known as, "that the one-man one-vote doesn't become a one-man one-vote one-time").


Somebody, no, "makar" - cunning - isn't one of God's 99 names. It's rather the name of the big bad wolf in children's stories, actually.
You really need to find better sources on Islam than the three little piglets" in arabic.
Some people, really.

Nobody: I'm mysterious? Hmm. Coming from you, I'll take that as a compliment. :)

nominally challenged said...

Mo-ha-med:

In a nutshell, what needs to be ensured if that the rules of the elections are not negotiable. Essentially that whomever wins the elections:
- does not put in jeopardy the basic rights;
- and does not put in jeopardy any future electoral processes
(otherwise known as, "that the one-man one-vote doesn't become a one-man one-vote one-time").


That is the definition of success of any working democracy. The question is - why haven't these kind of democracies sprouted up all over the Arab world. The object of this thread seems to be to try to understand what it is about Arab regimes - and their populations - that means that most Arab countries simply do not follow this model.

As you say: As for democracy in the Middle East - well, it's not that bad an idea.

No, in fact it might be a very good idea. However, it doesn't seem to have caught on in the ME, you have to admit, and the question is - why?

Nobody said...

Nobody: I'm mysterious? Hmm. Coming from you, I'll take that as a compliment. :)

Frankly, if I were Arab I would think that you are a secret agent collecting information about the region while pretending to be an innocent blogger. Because I am not Arab I don't think that you are a secret agent, but still I find your extensive traveling and destinations puzzling.

Never mind that all our conversations look like this:

Ashrawi? Oh yeah, I know her. I don't like her bossy style. She just learned to talk well, but this woman plainly thinks too much of herself. You see boy, when you meet a real leader, you know this is a real leader. A real leader is not bossy, he does not need to be one. Say, the old Assad. This man did not spoke a lot but he had those fucking piercing eyes. It's like somebody making you an x-rays or something. You feel yourself totally exposed. I did not enjoy my stays in Damascus at all. It was not a comfortable feeling.

Sorry, what do you say? Ah Hosni Mubarak. Well, he is an old guy. He does not really follow. You can't talk to him for more than five minutes without having the old boy falling asleep and snoring. But his son seems to be just the right type of person. I like him the very first time we come along.

And so on...

somebody said...

mo-ha-med, you deny that the koran refers to god as maqar?

somebody said...

54:سورة آل عمران - سورة :3

وَمَكَرُواْ وَمَكَرَ اللَّهُ وَاللَّهُ خَيْرُ الْمَاكِرِينَ

(Surah 3:54)
It actually says in surah 3 God is 'khayrul el makereen' -the greatest of deceivers. My bad for toning it down.

Oh, then there's Abu Bakr's testimony about the deception of God to verify the above. Leave the fairy tales and read up.

somebody said...

*'khayru elmakereen'

Mo-ha-med said...

Nominally Challenged:
I thought the purpose of this thread was the figure out the best way to replace our leaders with goats. :) Why no democracies in the Arab World? There's a large number of tentative explanations... Like anything, democracy requires the right incentives; internal (by people demanding oversight on the government resources) or, as seems to be the fashion these days, external pressure.

Set an economy awash with petrodollars thus providing public services, or better yet, quash those popular demands by force, and you have yourself a pretty dictatorship.

A while ago I drew the "poverty-politics curve": people get involved in politics - seek representativeness - either when they can afford it, or when they cannot afford not to be involved. Many Arab societies are kept on this edge, where they're barely getting by, and cannot afford to jeopardise their current societies.

Long debate...

Nobody:
You're hilarious!
Oh, i got the spy thing a lot. Including in Israel!
Got used to it. Somehow I think i'll go ask one either the egyptian state security, or the mossad - since they're usually my presumed employers - for some money, after all!!

I actually didn't like Mubarak Jr. when I first met him. He had this fake 'I'm too busy to notice what you're saying' air... too much for me. Pfff.

And I didn't meet Assad.. he never returned my calls. :-P

Mo-ha-med said...

Somebody:
Gosh, you're so typical. Very well.
Your first assertion was that 'makar is one of God's names': Wrong.
Google God's names or something, look for the 'makar' thing, and come back here to admit your error.

Second: you ask me a direct question:
"you deny that the koran refers to god as maqar?"
Answer: yes!
Oh, me is having a good laugh...

Here's your explanation:

"Makar" - let's say for the sake of the transliteration, with an 'a' before the last letter - is a form of affirmation, of repetitiveness; very often - not always, but often - this "repetitive form" is used not just to differentiate intensity but also takes a meaning of its own.

Hence, the big bad wolf is makar.

An example: fa3el - doer; fa3al --> all-powerful (roughly translated).

In the verse you cite - awfully translated - the adjective used is 'maaker' ماكر. Not 'makar' مكار. Verb Yamkor - seldom used as a verb, btw - means 'to plan'.

I checked SIX different translations of the Quran; none translated 'makaro' as 'deceived'. Perhaps it's a special Islam-hater translation you're using?

Here are some translations from widely-used english versions of the Quran:

And (the unbelievers) plotted and planned, and God too planned, and the best of planners is God.
(Abdullah Yusuf Ali translation)

And they (the disbelievers) schemed (against Jesus), and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best of schemers.
(Marmaduke Pickthall translation), same choice of verb (scheme) by Muhamad Asad.

"And they devised, and God devised, and God is the best of devisers"
(Arthur J. Arberry translation)

What's the word I'm looking for?

Oh, yeah.

BOO-YAH.

:)

Anonymous said...

Nobody, you are ruining your blog with all your fancy links! I think ever since you updated your way of posting, people come here to talk to you.

I know you explained that you post in the way that you think, but maybe it's hard for other people to circumnavigate your mind :)

Maybe if Nizo told you it was annoying you would listen :) :) :)
-Ellie

Anonymous said...

Oy are we examining the Koran now? Will we do the Talmud next? yawwwwwwnnnnnnnnnnnn

I wish you guys wouldn't ruin this great blog with your nonsense in which NO ONE can ever prove who is right and who is wrong.

-Ellie

Mo-ha-med said...

Ellie - I agree; terribly sorry I had to go through a lengthy academic explanation, which I didn't really want to engage in..
But the build-up to the 'Boo-yah' effect was worth it.
Yalla, off with that. :)

Nizo said...

All,
If you want to make me happy please spell Makkar with a double K. We should encourage all you non-Arabs to engage in gemination (stress) when properly pronouncing and transliterating our language.
Thank you.

Anonymous said...

Mo-Ha-Med,

I had a feeling you went through the whole thing just for the "Boo-yah."

How very makkar of you :) :) (Happy Nizo?)

-Ellie

G said...

Nizo;

Going back to the topic of your original post...I have a question:

If one would replace all of the Palestinian's leaders with goats, does this mean that the those same leaders would now have to take these goats’s place, providing milk and cream for the populace?

And who would take up the not-very-appealing task of pulling on those old and wrinkled testicles, squeezing out milk for Palestinian coffee and baby bottles?

Are YOU volunteering, Nizo? I know you’re up to it, for the cause and all that ;)

G

somebody said...

You too huh- You use the same pathetic arguments when you can't answer something- you don 't know arabic, you're a hater blah blah. But really congratulations, you've introduced another way of arguing and not addressing the issue- fussing over transliteration.

I gave you the verse in arabic and then you replied by giving me english translations and arabic lessons. please stop making assumptions about me. Now, i'd like to return the favour so here's your arabic lesson. This time no transliterations so you don't get confused between this and the big bad wolf story.

Allah is described as:

خَيْرُ الْمَاكِرِينَ

the root:

مكر

which means
خداع

(arabic dictionary)

or in english:

cunning, craftiness, slyness and deception- arabic-english dictionary.

I have just stated dictionary definitions- if you have a problem with what the dictionary says then please take it up with the authors.

nizo- sorry for hogging your blog's comments section. - last one.

Nobody said...


Are YOU volunteering, Nizo? I know you’re up to it, for the cause and all that ;)


By the way, where is the boss? Where he's gone?

Nobody said...

or in english:

cunning, craftiness, slyness and deception- arabic-english dictionary.

I have just stated dictionary definitions- if you have a problem with what the dictionary says then please take it up with the authors.


i think it's a blind alley. Your argument will get nowhere, since what's intended here is not that Allah is deceiving people on purpose. It's more like that you should not play tricks on him as you can't outsmart him.

Nobody said...

Oh

I should stop drinking so much

:D :D

Nobody said...

Hey Nizo

You should post something new. I am starting getting lost here between 100 and something comments

Nizo said...

G said
"And who would take up the not-very-appealing task of pulling on those old and wrinkled testicles, squeezing out milk for Palestinian coffee and baby bottles?

Are YOU volunteering, Nizo? I know you’re up to it, for the cause and all that ;)"

G,
I would start by squeezing the massive growth on Mahmoud Al-Zahar's nose. I think that's where they're hiding Gilad Shalit...

SnoopyTheGoon said...

I protest this statement of bigoatry, Nizo! If one Palestinian goat is able to replace one Palestinian politician, one Jewish goat will be easily able to replace two Jewish politicians! No doubts about it, and we'll do it first.

Anonymous said...

What happened to that hilarious Urshalim post? Did you come under pressure to remove it?

Nizo said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

hey nizo!

just found this article and thought you might be interested:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7968812.stm

ldw

p.s. i've only recently discovered your blog and i think it's great!